New Phyrexia Spoiler

I think the mana-cost might be a bit high (I think 6-cc would have been better, maybe shave the P/T), but yeah, I'll agree with Dan and state your board will be massacred if this thing resolves.

Cool art, either way.

Slyphidine wrote:It is a bit win-more, but not without precedent in the white color wheel (thanks to this guy).

there are 5 white cards (that demand ONLY white mana or plains) currently in print that directly, and without combat (omitting flanking), give -X/-X to creatures.

1 is from The Dark (pre-modern color pie)
Holy Light

2 are from Planar Chaos (color pie bleed was a thing)
Serra's Boon
Crovax, Ascendant Hero

2 are from Mirrodin Besieged (and therefore are based upon the same flavor premise as any New Phyrexia cards)
Gore Vassal
Choking Fumes (and wait, this demands combat)

so these are our precedents. i don't think there is enough to open this portion of white's pie to creature withering! it should be in black, i really can't justify especially "choking fumes" in white. terrible air has always been a black (somtimes red) thing:

Stench of Evil
Stench of Decay
Pestilence
Fume Spitter
Nausea
Toxic Stench
Darkblast
Peppersmoke
etc. (i can't think of anymore off-hand... help?)

MidniteEffort wrote:let's start with a real card...

Spoiler:

new creature type, Praetor. i guess they are setting up for the Roman set...

fucking LOVE this art. The card is back breaking, and makes a sick EDH general.

My immediate reaction to Elesh was that I need it for my token deck. Upon closer inspection, I agree with Jim. Should have been a little cheaper and smaller.

Uniclonus wrote:My immediate reaction to Elesh was that I need it for my token deck. Upon closer inspection, I agree with Jim. Should have been a little cheaper and smaller.

I agree though, the Praetor would be amazing for your token deck. I don't think the 7cc will really be much of a barrier to use in Big Deck, considering the fact that I've hard-cast Inkwell Leviathan or a Blightsteel Colossus on occasion.

is no one else upset about the blatant color pie violations found in Elesh Norn and Suture Priest?

i know R&D has been on a mission to increase the power level of white in the last few years, but just cannibalizing black abilities isn't an innovative solution.

on a related note, does anybody know the article in which they discussed which color was next to be empowered?

MidniteEffort wrote:is no one else upset about the blatant color pie violations found in Elesh Norn and Suture Priest?

Big creature. She fun.

I don't mind the color bleed since these are Phyrexian cards in a heavy Phyrexian set. In that sense, the abilities make sense. Plus it's effectively a one-off event, like the colorshifted stuff in Planar Chaos. If it weren't for that, I'd have a little bit of a problem.

MidniteEffort wrote:is no one else upset about the blatant color pie violations found in Elesh Norn and Suture Priest?

No. In fact, I'd like to see more of it.

~Zuty

WHOA lots of stuff coming in....

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=313733

colorless planeswalker...

Karn's abilities are:

+4 Target Players Exiles a Card from his or her hand

-3 Exile Target Permanent

-14 Return all exiled cards (except auras) to play under your control

weird alternate mana... which i have a problem with. how are you supposed to tell the colors apart clearly?

Like the Chancellors a lot. I can see Chancellor of the Dross making you a target on turn zero in multiplayer. And I will point out the impossible dream play right now, of having 4 in your opening hand in multiplayer. In a 4 man game, your opponenst each lose 12 life, and you gain 48. And then you die.

Agreed about the colors (though it reminds you consistently in the flavor text).

As an aside, does it bother anyone else when you show someone a card with a new mechanic and they immediately ask what it does... when there's reminder text RIGHT underneath it. When beginner players do it, it's obviously understandable, but veterans should know better.

So far this set looks pretty awesome.

Just posted on mtgsalvation about Karn's ultimate:

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but the translations I've seen of Karn's ultimate so far are not complete. It says:

"Set aside all non-aura permanents exiled by Karn, The Exiled, then restart the game. Then put all cards set aside this way onto the battlefield under your control."

...now that's insane.

I'll look once they have official translations. To many pages to go through and to many people guessing.

Also ... Alternative mana, kind of like Purple mana (which I am SURE they used while they designed and play tested the cards) ... If only someone saw this coming ... OH WAIT ... I did :3

~Zuty

Zuty wrote:I'll look once they have official translations. To many pages to go through and to many people guessing.

Also ... Alternative mana, kind of like Purple mana (which I am SURE they used while they designed and play tested the cards) ... If only someone saw this coming ... OH WAIT ... I did :3

~Zuty

Not so much an alternate mana as it is alternate cost, paying life for a spell instead of mana is an old trick (like Snuff Out). I think it's going to end up translating something like:

"Rather than paying W you may pay 2 life for each W in ~'s mana cost"

Phyrexian Canceller
Mythic
bbbb
Creature - Horror
5/5
Trample
Whenever a source deals damage to ~, that source's controller sacrifices that many permanents.
"It is blessed compleatness." --Sheoldred, Whispering One

UH WHAT

reverse, i.e. NO DRAWBACK, Negator! yes please.

Praetor's Grip
Rare
1bb
Sorcery
Search your opponent's deck for a card and exile it facedown. While it's exiled this way, you may look at it and play it as though it were in your hand.

ooooh big deck.

Caged Sun
Rare
6
When Caged Sun enters the battlefield, choose a color.
Creatures you control of the chosen color have +1/+1.
Whenever you tap a land for mana, add one mana of the chosen color to your mana pool.

i'll need about 6 of these. i love a one-sided Gauntlet of Power.

Norn's Annex
Rare
3PP
Artifact
(P may be paid for with either W or 2 life.)
Creatures can't attack you or Planeswalkers you control unless their controller pays P for each attacking creature.

i think this is the first card that has mentioned planeswalkers outside of reminder text.

Puresteel Paladin
Rare
ww
2/2
Creature - Human Knight
Whenever an Equipment enters the battlefield under your control, you may draw a card.
Metalcraft - As long as you control 3 or more artifacts, equip costs of equipment you control is 0.

yikes, card advantage + mana advantage at a very low cost. probably the best equipment enabler since Stoneforge Mystic... so not very long.

I wondering how we're going to classify some of these new Phyrexian mana costs for the artifacts in Big Deck, are we going to consider them colorless or colored? With their colored borders and mana-symbols I'm almost tempted to consider them colored-artifacts, like the Alara ones, though you can get away with casting them with only colorless mana (and life).

redxxii wrote:I wondering how we're going to classify some of these new Phyrexian mana costs for the artifacts in Big Deck, are we going to consider them colorless or colored? With their colored borders and mana-symbols I'm almost tempted to consider them colored-artifacts, like the Alara ones, though you can get away with casting them with only colorless mana (and life).

I'm sure there's a ruling on their actual color. Once we get it, we'll follow it.

"Species Transplantation"
Rare
4U
Enchantment
When ~ enters the battlefield, choose a creature type.
Creatures you control are the chosen type in addition to their other creature types.
"There is no word more worthless than "evolution" from the mouth of Vorinclex. The only one who knows true Progress is me." -Jin-Gitaxis, Core Augur.

Jin-Gitaxis believes in Intelligent Design, I see.

A Conspiracy variant. I love Conspiracy!

Slyphidine wrote:

redxxii wrote:I wondering how we're going to classify some of these new Phyrexian mana costs for the artifacts in Big Deck, are we going to consider them colorless or colored? With their colored borders and mana-symbols I'm almost tempted to consider them colored-artifacts, like the Alara ones, though you can get away with casting them with only colorless mana (and life).

I'm sure there's a ruling on their actual color. Once we get it, we'll follow it.

Looks like they're considered colored in the MTGSalvation number crunch, which makes me extremely happy.

redxxii wrote:Looks like they're considered colored in the MTGSalvation number crunch, which makes me extremely happy.

yea, and well they should be. it's probably like the 2/C hybrid cost.

Slyphidine wrote:Just posted on mtgsalvation about Karn's ultimate:

Sorry if this has already been brought up, but the translations I've seen of Karn's ultimate so far are not complete. It says:

"Set aside all non-aura permanents exiled by Karn, The Exiled, then restart the game. Then put all cards set aside this way onto the battlefield under your control."

...now that's insane.

hey, uh, we're going to have to think hard about allowing this in Big Deck. getting all of the permanents would be fine alone; restarting the game is HELLA annoying in our huge roundtable games.